I love this column! I am an unabashedly celibate 65 year old woman- long divorced and several boyfriends in my past. Those were joyful, messy and sometimes painful experiences. My life now is amazingly fulfilling, rich with friendships male and female, and decidedly less complicated than most of my companions. People I meet who quiz me about my life choices are always curious, sometimes judgmental, and usually kind of jealous. Do I sometimes get lonely? Sure! But I was really lonely in my marriage, too. and that was way worse. I made my own decision on how to live my life and have no regrets.
Substack for excellent column-length writing (Lyz, Heather Cox Richardson, Paul Krugman), Reddit for the smartest and wittiest goddamned minds dancing through the internet. They make me laugh uncontrollably while deftly disassembling the idiots ruining our timeline. I visualize an army of super-smart chipmunks on crack banging on the keyboard.
My older son only had a girlfriend for a few weeks in middle school, and he is apparently typical among his friends. They have better things to do right now, which is good! I grew up when EVERYONE had to be dating in high school and I just, well, didn’t. At the time I hated it, but in retrospect that was really important for me and my mental health. Kids can take their time and find out about themselves first; be an adult when forming a family!
Since my marriage ended 13 years ago I've gone through a couple of protracted periods of celibacy. Three years after leaving my marriage, then again now, when I'm staring down two years this coming fall. It's interesting how the two periods are the same and different. That first stint was almost easy because there was no part of me after surviving my marriage that could imagine letting someone in emotionally. I've got no moral judgments on casual sex. I've just never been good at it, so I knew I'd have to be in a relationship and I definitely didn't want one.
This time it's harder. I feel more confident in what I'm capable of in relationship, clearer on what I want and don't. But it's ugly out there, especially for women who mostly sleep with men, and I'm protective of my peace. That first stint I wasn't sure if anyone would ever love me. This time, I love me and my life and my kids and my community and I'm not confident about finding someone who is capable of being a vibrant addition to all of that but who also has their own vibrant life. My experience with men has been that they mostly want someone to fold quietly into their life, and I don't fold anymore.
The good news, though, is that my life is great. My son and I just put an offer in on a wooded, rural property outside of town that we want to share. His partner and friends are fantastic and enjoy me. My youngest is starting college in the fall. Their partner and friends are also great. My friends are amazing and my relationship with my family is solid and loving, maybe for the first time in my life. So, the downsides of celibacy are small potatoes comparatively. I am loved and free.
They want us to fit neatly into their lives but refuse to make any changes that might cause them to have to do something different. And when you state that you are not willing to be the only one making the compromises, you are called names and castigated for not being willing to be the woman they want instead of the woman you are.
I’ve been divorced after a long-term marriage since late 2018. I tried Match briefly during the pandemic but Zoom dating felt pointless. Then I just focused on my job, got a doctorate, and steered my sons through high school into college. Now that they are ready to graduate college, I tried Hinge this year but all my likes are from men in their 20s. I’m 59! I give up. I’m focusing on my female friendship network, being physically active, and my work. I’m lonely sometimes and I’d like to have company for dinner or cultural activities occasionally, but I’m ok. What else can I do?
i remember asking my now 94 year old grandma why women would want to be a nun and she very simply said "They wanted to have a career" and wow that really hits today
I don’t know about others here, but I remember when the media started talking about the 4B movement, and how some women were online saying, “I was doing this before it was an official trend.”
I don’t have much of a romantic history outside of a few years in my early 20s, but being single has surprised me in the best of ways. It really is wonderful and freeing to not have to fixate on who desires me or not, who I’m texting, or who wants to go out on another date. I’m not even opposed to having a romantic partner, but the more I think about my life, the more I have to wonder what I’m missing because things are so good now.
Doing my own thing has been much better for my overall wellbeing than a steady serving of fictional fairytales. No turning back.
Still in purgatory of being lonelier in a “relationship” than on my own, I am figuring out ways to take next steps towards self reliance which includes self acceptance. In my mind I am there but 18 spent raising a son and 20 years with a partner who I was SO hoping would be the one has left me facing deeper truths easier to see reflected in posts like this. Thank you for your writing and exploration.
If /when my marriage ends I doubt I’d ever try to date again. 1. I’m getting up there in years. 2. I don’t have the patience or bandwidth to invest in new people (exception grandkids and pets) at this point. 3. The rate of returns is worse than a saving account.
I came to the point where I loathed online dating sites. I divorced my first husband when I was 29, back in 2001...so I was one of the first to use Match.com and all that...it only got worse as the years went on. I would sign up for a bit, then get off for 6 months at a time. As I got older, I cared less and less. So, I think the takeaway here is that we may glamorize the 20-something woman who is at the peak of her health and beauty, but we are hormonal and naive at this age, chasing feelings, and not knowing who we are. It is SO important to spend time alone and to learn to love ourselves so that we know what we want (do we REALLY want a relationship, or are those the hormones speaking?) and we are happily content spending time with ourselves. I was single for 21 years after that. I had given up dating sites for a year. I was truly content. And I was ready to spend my life alone at age 50. When - voila - I met my husband at the dog park. Organically. Communicating. Getting to know each other. Having deep conversations. This went on for a year. We didn't even exchange phone numbers for that long. It was just a nice friendship at the park. But both of us had done the work by this time and he, too, was ready to be single for the rest of his life. Therefore, I think what I can impart to others is to BE OK WITH YOURSELF first and explore the world and take chances and DO YOU. And yeah, I love my husband. He is my best friend. But if I lost him tomorrow, I'd be ok. I know me and I don't NEED anyone. That's the rub. Be with another because you enjoy them and want to spend time with them. Not because you NEED them. If this is the case, you need to spend more time on yourself.
Just started The Dry Season while experiencing what I just realized is the FIRST time since I was EIGHT years old where I wasn’t married, dating, sleeping around or flirting with some unrequited crush on the playground. Very grateful for Melissa Febos words ALWAYS but especially now bc woof. Also Reddit is only genuinely honest place on the Internet, I fear!
I love Reddit myself! My former place for sharing and talking went away and I needed something to occupy my time. I will say I got perma-banned from colour theory and now I’ll never know which shade of blue is my best. But it does have something for everyone. It is a cesspool of evil filth but I try to avoid them.
I love the sound of this books. I’ve given up on sex and romance. They are separate to me. I don’t care about hurting anyone or spiting?
I’m tired. I’m tired. I’m too tired to sort through people and find someone intelligent, attractive and not conservative (a rarity in one of the top 10 conservative cities in America).
I had a delightful sex period for years. But I got tired of teaching men where the clitoris is and why it exists. My stunted relationships with women went nowhere.
Anyway. I’m tired. I go to bed at 9pm and wake up at 6:30. I have a dog and a mother and I’m good.
I love opting out. I didn’t know it was an option until Sommer Tothill said it’s perfectly rational to not want to date men. That made me realize it’s ok & actually wise (but still can be painful in some ways to stop seeking the gender you’re attracted to). But the constant hope to disappoint cycle is exhausting & it’s a game with very bad odds for women. I love the 4b movement- they aren’t opting out to punish men- they see men as irredeemable. Thanks for writing about the “opt out” revolution!
I love Reddit forums as well. It’s something I’ve turned to that’s so much better than reading the headlines.
I love this column! I am an unabashedly celibate 65 year old woman- long divorced and several boyfriends in my past. Those were joyful, messy and sometimes painful experiences. My life now is amazingly fulfilling, rich with friendships male and female, and decidedly less complicated than most of my companions. People I meet who quiz me about my life choices are always curious, sometimes judgmental, and usually kind of jealous. Do I sometimes get lonely? Sure! But I was really lonely in my marriage, too. and that was way worse. I made my own decision on how to live my life and have no regrets.
SAME! People are so perplexed that you can have a full life without having a partner. It would be funny if it weren't so ridiculous.
💯
Substack for excellent column-length writing (Lyz, Heather Cox Richardson, Paul Krugman), Reddit for the smartest and wittiest goddamned minds dancing through the internet. They make me laugh uncontrollably while deftly disassembling the idiots ruining our timeline. I visualize an army of super-smart chipmunks on crack banging on the keyboard.
My older son only had a girlfriend for a few weeks in middle school, and he is apparently typical among his friends. They have better things to do right now, which is good! I grew up when EVERYONE had to be dating in high school and I just, well, didn’t. At the time I hated it, but in retrospect that was really important for me and my mental health. Kids can take their time and find out about themselves first; be an adult when forming a family!
Since my marriage ended 13 years ago I've gone through a couple of protracted periods of celibacy. Three years after leaving my marriage, then again now, when I'm staring down two years this coming fall. It's interesting how the two periods are the same and different. That first stint was almost easy because there was no part of me after surviving my marriage that could imagine letting someone in emotionally. I've got no moral judgments on casual sex. I've just never been good at it, so I knew I'd have to be in a relationship and I definitely didn't want one.
This time it's harder. I feel more confident in what I'm capable of in relationship, clearer on what I want and don't. But it's ugly out there, especially for women who mostly sleep with men, and I'm protective of my peace. That first stint I wasn't sure if anyone would ever love me. This time, I love me and my life and my kids and my community and I'm not confident about finding someone who is capable of being a vibrant addition to all of that but who also has their own vibrant life. My experience with men has been that they mostly want someone to fold quietly into their life, and I don't fold anymore.
The good news, though, is that my life is great. My son and I just put an offer in on a wooded, rural property outside of town that we want to share. His partner and friends are fantastic and enjoy me. My youngest is starting college in the fall. Their partner and friends are also great. My friends are amazing and my relationship with my family is solid and loving, maybe for the first time in my life. So, the downsides of celibacy are small potatoes comparatively. I am loved and free.
"I don't fold anymore" is BRILLIANT.
They want us to fit neatly into their lives but refuse to make any changes that might cause them to have to do something different. And when you state that you are not willing to be the only one making the compromises, you are called names and castigated for not being willing to be the woman they want instead of the woman you are.
I know not as many people are on it as used to be on Twitter (pronounced shitter), but have you tried BluSky?
I’ve been divorced after a long-term marriage since late 2018. I tried Match briefly during the pandemic but Zoom dating felt pointless. Then I just focused on my job, got a doctorate, and steered my sons through high school into college. Now that they are ready to graduate college, I tried Hinge this year but all my likes are from men in their 20s. I’m 59! I give up. I’m focusing on my female friendship network, being physically active, and my work. I’m lonely sometimes and I’d like to have company for dinner or cultural activities occasionally, but I’m ok. What else can I do?
i remember asking my now 94 year old grandma why women would want to be a nun and she very simply said "They wanted to have a career" and wow that really hits today
Reddit is incredibly addicting, and I fight it every day. Except I love it.
Same!
I don’t know about others here, but I remember when the media started talking about the 4B movement, and how some women were online saying, “I was doing this before it was an official trend.”
I don’t have much of a romantic history outside of a few years in my early 20s, but being single has surprised me in the best of ways. It really is wonderful and freeing to not have to fixate on who desires me or not, who I’m texting, or who wants to go out on another date. I’m not even opposed to having a romantic partner, but the more I think about my life, the more I have to wonder what I’m missing because things are so good now.
Doing my own thing has been much better for my overall wellbeing than a steady serving of fictional fairytales. No turning back.
Still in purgatory of being lonelier in a “relationship” than on my own, I am figuring out ways to take next steps towards self reliance which includes self acceptance. In my mind I am there but 18 spent raising a son and 20 years with a partner who I was SO hoping would be the one has left me facing deeper truths easier to see reflected in posts like this. Thank you for your writing and exploration.
If /when my marriage ends I doubt I’d ever try to date again. 1. I’m getting up there in years. 2. I don’t have the patience or bandwidth to invest in new people (exception grandkids and pets) at this point. 3. The rate of returns is worse than a saving account.
I came to the point where I loathed online dating sites. I divorced my first husband when I was 29, back in 2001...so I was one of the first to use Match.com and all that...it only got worse as the years went on. I would sign up for a bit, then get off for 6 months at a time. As I got older, I cared less and less. So, I think the takeaway here is that we may glamorize the 20-something woman who is at the peak of her health and beauty, but we are hormonal and naive at this age, chasing feelings, and not knowing who we are. It is SO important to spend time alone and to learn to love ourselves so that we know what we want (do we REALLY want a relationship, or are those the hormones speaking?) and we are happily content spending time with ourselves. I was single for 21 years after that. I had given up dating sites for a year. I was truly content. And I was ready to spend my life alone at age 50. When - voila - I met my husband at the dog park. Organically. Communicating. Getting to know each other. Having deep conversations. This went on for a year. We didn't even exchange phone numbers for that long. It was just a nice friendship at the park. But both of us had done the work by this time and he, too, was ready to be single for the rest of his life. Therefore, I think what I can impart to others is to BE OK WITH YOURSELF first and explore the world and take chances and DO YOU. And yeah, I love my husband. He is my best friend. But if I lost him tomorrow, I'd be ok. I know me and I don't NEED anyone. That's the rub. Be with another because you enjoy them and want to spend time with them. Not because you NEED them. If this is the case, you need to spend more time on yourself.
Just started The Dry Season while experiencing what I just realized is the FIRST time since I was EIGHT years old where I wasn’t married, dating, sleeping around or flirting with some unrequited crush on the playground. Very grateful for Melissa Febos words ALWAYS but especially now bc woof. Also Reddit is only genuinely honest place on the Internet, I fear!
I love Reddit myself! My former place for sharing and talking went away and I needed something to occupy my time. I will say I got perma-banned from colour theory and now I’ll never know which shade of blue is my best. But it does have something for everyone. It is a cesspool of evil filth but I try to avoid them.
I love the sound of this books. I’ve given up on sex and romance. They are separate to me. I don’t care about hurting anyone or spiting?
I’m tired. I’m tired. I’m too tired to sort through people and find someone intelligent, attractive and not conservative (a rarity in one of the top 10 conservative cities in America).
I had a delightful sex period for years. But I got tired of teaching men where the clitoris is and why it exists. My stunted relationships with women went nowhere.
Anyway. I’m tired. I go to bed at 9pm and wake up at 6:30. I have a dog and a mother and I’m good.
I love opting out. I didn’t know it was an option until Sommer Tothill said it’s perfectly rational to not want to date men. That made me realize it’s ok & actually wise (but still can be painful in some ways to stop seeking the gender you’re attracted to). But the constant hope to disappoint cycle is exhausting & it’s a game with very bad odds for women. I love the 4b movement- they aren’t opting out to punish men- they see men as irredeemable. Thanks for writing about the “opt out” revolution!
Yes! It’s not so much punitive as saying, “My dudes, be better!”